ARI SHAPIRO, HOST:
This is a spot that has sat at the center of global trade for more than a century, connecting two oceans. The things Americans use every day pass through here, from cars to food. And now, this spot is also at the center of President Trump's global expansionist agenda. This morning, Secretary of State Marco Rubio wrapped up a visit to Panama, and here's what his boss, President Trump, said yesterday.
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PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: China's running the Panama Canal. That was not given to China. That was given to Panama foolishly. But they violated the agreement, and we're going to take it back or something very powerful is going to happen.
SHAPIRO: His claim that China operates the canal is false, and we'll dig into that more in a minute.
When Rubio woke up here in Panama City yesterday morning, he went to services at a church where cameras were not allowed. But a different Sunday morning service live streamed into Panamanians homes all over the country.
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UNIDENTIFIED SINGERS: (Singing, inaudible).
SHAPIRO: Archbishop Jose Domingo Ulloa offered a homily that gives you a sense of how Panamanians are feeling right now.
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JOSE DOMINGO ULLOA: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "Sovereignty and the good name of Panama are not given away or negotiated," he said from the pulpit. "They are defended with determination and love for the homeland."
Trump's focus on the canal has brought out a nationalistic streak here in Panama. The country's flag flutters along roadsides, on buildings and in front yards. Panamanians told me they don't even see this many flags on Independence Day. After Sunday morning services, Secretary Rubio met with Panama's President Jose Raul Mulino. Here's how the president described that meeting.
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PRESIDENT JOSE RAUL MULINO: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "I didn't feel any sense of controversy, just a climate of respect," he said.
The State Department described things differently. According to a spokesperson's statement, Rubio told Mulino that President Trump has made a preliminary determination that China has too much influence over the canal, which he says violates international treaties. The statement continued, quote, "absent immediate changes, it would require the United States to take measures necessary to protect its rights." Rubio did not comment publicly on the meeting. President Mulino told reporters he's happy to discuss immigration and drug trafficking, but the canal is not up for debate.
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MULINO: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "Panama's sovereignty is not in question. That is very important," he said.
Panamanians will tell you that this fight is about identity, neocolonialism and whether strong countries can push around weaker ones. And that may all be true, but narrowly speaking, this fight is specifically about a 51-mile waterway that is essential to global commerce. Forty percent of U.S. maritime traffic passes through this canal. Panama fully took control of the passage in 1999. But when President Jimmy Carter signed those treaties back in 1977, he said the agreements showed the kind of leader he wanted the U.S. to be.
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JIMMY CARTER: They marked the commitment of the United States to the belief that fairness and not force should lie at the heart of our dealings with the nations of the world.
SHAPIRO: That line about fairness, not force, is so meaningful to Panama, it is actually on a metal plaque at the base of a statue in the heart of this city. In 2016, Panama expanded the canal, and now about 35 ships pass through daily. The U.S. accounts for more than three-quarters of the traffic.
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SHAPIRO: This is one of the few places in the world where you actually want to be on a sinking ship.
UNIDENTIFIED GUIDE: Be welcome to one of the wonders of the world. Be welcome to the Panama Canal.
SHAPIRO: The visitor center at the Miraflores Locks may be the best place to see the canal in action. Picture three enormous steps. Millions of gallons of water flood into or out of the locks to float massive ships one step at a time from the Pacific Ocean to the Atlantic or vice versa. Tourists from all over the world come here. Most of the Panamanians you meet at the Miraflores Locks are hosting folks from out of town, like Edwin Scott (ph), who brought a friend from Mexico to show off his country's pride and joy.
EDWIN SCOTT: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "For a Panamanian, there's just no words," he says. "The canal is the most important institution we have." He believes this fight isn't really about Panama. He thinks his country just had the bad luck to get caught between two giants - the U.S. and China.
SCOTT: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "I think Mr. Trump has this psychosis with Chinese people. There aren't Chinese people in the canal," he says.
What do you think will happen?
SCOTT: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "I don't know, because he's obsessed with the Chinese people," Scott says.
So back to China's role here, there is no truth to Trump's claim that China operates the canal. But a company based in Hong Kong, called CK Hutchison Holdings, operates two of the five ports surrounding the canal. We asked the company for an interview, and they declined. We also requested interviews with the Canal Authority, Secretary Rubio, the president of Panama and the mayor of Panama City. The fact that none of them agreed may be a sign of just how delicate this moment is. So to clarify some of the facts here, I called ambassador John Feeley. He's a career diplomat and former U.S. ambassador to Panama. Appointed late in the Obama administration, he stayed in the role for two years under Trump. He still knows lots of people in Panama, and he says this controversy caught them all off guard.
JOHN FEELEY: And so I'm telling the Panamanians that they need to take this deadly seriously.
SHAPIRO: He says he's been warning about China's influence in Latin America since at least 2017.
FEELEY: I tried to get the Trump administration to pay a lot more attention to Panama's recognition of Beijing, and I got nothing.
SHAPIRO: So without being inflammatory, what is the threat that China poses to the United States in Panama?
FEELEY: The threat is not military. The two port concessions that a Hong Kong-based company operate do not have the military logistical capability to shut the canal down. The canal is run by an independent agency in Panama.
SHAPIRO: He says the threat from China is more subtle. It's about economic engagement, and it stretches far beyond the Panama Canal to places all over the region where China is investing and the U.S. is not.
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UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTOR: (Shouting in non-English language).
UNIDENTIFIED PROTESTERS: (Chanting in non-English language).
SHAPIRO: In protests all over the city, Panamanians made their feelings clear. In one, construction workers burned an American flag in the middle of a major street. At another, a woman showed up at the finish line pushing a cart. She shaved a massive block of ice into snow cones, topped with condensed milk and fruit syrups.
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SHAPIRO: The teachers union organized this demonstration.
MARLENAS NUNEZ: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "The canal is ours," says a high school art teacher named Marlenas Nunez (ph).
NUNEZ: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "He'll have to kill us all," she says. "We are small, but we have a huge heart."
You are a teacher.
NUNEZ: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: You are not a soldier.
NUNEZ: (Speaking Spanish).
SHAPIRO: "No, but I'm willing to defend my canal," she says.
Panama was the first country Rubio visited as secretary of state. But he kept a low profile, saying nothing publicly about the canal through all of his meetings and events yesterday. By the time he did say something on the record about the canal, he was in El Salvador, and he mostly reiterated what President Trump had already said.
We'll be hearing voices from Panama all throughout the show today as we continue hosting ALL THINGS CONSIDERED from the edge of the Panama Canal. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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