WLRN has partnered with PolitiFact to fact-check Florida politicians. The Pulitzer Prize-winning team seeks to present the true facts, unaffected by agenda or biases.
In a flurry of attacks against his likely 2024 presidential opponent, former President Donald Trump said Vice President Kamala Harris allowed millions of immigrants to illegally "stampede" across the border and supported eliminating a central immigration enforcement agency.
"Lyin’ Kamala supported abolishing ICE," Trump said July 24 at a Charlotte, North Carolina, campaign rally.
Trump, who pilloried several parts of Harris’ record, was referring to Immigration and Customs Enforcement, the agency in charge of detaining and deporting immigrants who are illegally in the United States.
In spring 2018, the "abolish ICE" movement drew attention after Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York won her House primary and said it was "time to abolish" the agency. A small number of Democratic lawmakers or candidates supported the "abolish ICE" movement as a protest against Trump policies. Congress never abolished Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
The Trump and Harris campaigns responded to our query about Trump’s rally claim with multiple citations of Harris statements; we found many more through our own research. There is no record of Harris saying she would "abolish ICE," a specific phrase that others like Ocasio-Cortez have used. And in 2019, when asked point-blank if she supports abolishing the Department of Homeland Security, which oversees Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Harris said no.
READ MORE: Trump, Scott, pot and abortion are favored by Florida voters in a recent survey
Trump campaign spokesperson Steven Cheung told PolitiFact that Harris "ran on a platform dedicated to defunding the police and abolishing ICE, and there is no question that she will implement these horrible policies if she has the chance."
Harris criticized Immigration and Customs Enforcement in 2018, but also said it had a role
Harris, as a California senator, criticized the Trump administration’s immigration policies, including a deterrence policy that led to the separation of children and parents who arrived at the border illegally.
In a March 2018 MSNBC interview, Harris said Immigration and Customs Enforcement should exist to deport people who commit serious and violent crimes, including rape, murder and child molestation.
"So, yes, ICE has a purpose. ICE has a role, ICE should exist," Harris said. "But let’s not abuse the power. Let’s not extend it to areas that were not — that are not posing a threat to the safety and the public safety of these communities, especially when we know that these federal agencies have limited resources to do their core job."
The Trump campaign pointed to a June 2018 MSNBC interview in which host Kasie Hunt asked Harris whether she agreed with the calls to abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
Harris: "Listen, I think there is no question that we’ve got to critically reexamine ICE and its role and the way it is being administered and the work it is doing. And we need to probably even think about starting from scratch because there’s a lot that is wrong with the way that it is conducting itself and we need to deal with that."
Hunt: "What do you think should be the alternative to ICE?"
Harris: "Well, first of all, I don't think that the government should be in the position of separating families and that is clearly what is part of what's happening at ICE and DHS. You look at what’s happening again in terms of how they are conducting their perspective on asylum seekers. That is a real problem and is contrary to all the spirit and the reason we even have the asylum rules and laws in the first place. So, their mission I think is very much in question and has to be reexamined."
On ABC’s "The View" in 2019, Harris was asked whether she would abolish the Department of Homeland Security, which includes Immigration and Customs Enforcement.
"No, I would not," Harris said. She called the department "dysfunctional" and said the government needs to "fix it, but I do not believe in getting rid of it."
Harris’ other comments do not prove she wanted to abolish the agency
The Trump campaign also pointed to other Harris statements that were critical of Trump’s immigration enforcement policies, but none of the comments go as far as Trump claimed in his remarks.
In 2019, Harris called raids on workplaces the Trump administration’s "campaign of terror" that she said would make immigrants afraid to go to work. Harris co-sponsored legislation to block Immigration and Customs Enforcement arrests at schools, hospitals, and religious institutions without prior approval and exigent circumstances.
The Washington Post in 2020 reported that Harris was among the politicians who wanted to restructure the agency, but not abolish it. NPR reached similar conclusions in 2018.
The Trump campaign also pointed to a 2008 New York Times article written when Harris was San Francisco district attorney. But this article does not address Harris’ stance on Immigration and Customs Enforcement’s existence; it said San Francisco was assuring immigrants who were in the country illegally that the city would not report them to federal immigration authorities. In the article, Harris said criminals tend to tell their victims who are in the country illegally that they will be treated as criminals because of their immigration status.
Harris’ 2019 presidential primary immigration platform did not call for abolishing Immigration and Customs Enforcement. She called to overhaul immigration enforcement policies and focus enforcement on increasing public safety. The Biden-Harris ticket’s 2020 campaign platform also did not call for abolishing the agency.
In February 2024, Harris backed bipartisan legislation that included border enforcement. The bill sought to limit the number of asylum seekers and included funding for Immigration and Customs Enforcement to increase detention capacity and removal flights and hire more personnel.
That proposal died amid Republican opposition.
Our ruling
Trump said Harris "supported abolishing ICE."
It’s clear that Harris opposed, and opposes, many of Trump’s immigration positions. And she called for an end to the hard-line tactics that had been used by the administration.
But she never said she would abolish Immigration and Customs Enforcement. In fact, she said the opposite.
We rate Trump’s statement False.
Copyright 2024 WLRN Public Media
